tv CNN Newsroom CNN November 23, 2014 11:00am-12:01pm PST
afghanistan and the fed rated states of micronesia are next. india has the next number, 356 million. thanks to all of you for being part of my program this week. i will see you next week. a tragedy. a 12-year-old boy shot and killed by a police officer after officers get this 911 call. >> there is a guy with a pistol. he is, like, pointing it ought everybody. >> it turns out the gun was fake, but police say the officer didn't know that, and one of the nation's most prestigious universities puts a temporary ban on a long-time tradition. why all fraternities are suspended at the university of
virginia and what it could mean for other schools? senator lindsey graham is furious that there was no coverup in the aftermath of the benghazi attack. >> no. no. i think that -- i think the report is full of crap. >> why? >> quite frankly. >> who he says dropped the ball. >> hello. i'm fredericka whitfield. we begin with a developing story. a 12-year-old boy shot and killed after police spotted him with what turned out to be a fake gun. the police opened fire. investigators say officers got a call yesterday afternoon for a boy waving a gun in a park. we now know that that gun was not real. sarah gannon has more on what
happened. >> the gun was fake. an air soft replica gun that looks like a semiautomatic pistol, cleveland police said. the orange tabitha identifies it as a bb type gun had been removed. it's not clear if the corresponding officers knew that the gun was fake when they arrived at the playground where the 911 call was made. when an officer order the boy to put his hands in the air, police say the boy instead reached for his waist band. >> there was no confrontation. the officers ordered him to stop and to show his hands, and he went into his waist band and pulled out the weapon. >> police say the officer fired two shots and the boy was hit in the torso.
he died sunday morning following surgery. the family's attorney told cnn "it's devastating. a mom lets her son go to the park, then finds out he has been shot. we're starting our investigation. we're gathering our witnesses, and they're gathering theirs." the cleveland police use of force team is also investigating. the job is to spopd to assignments and protect the community, and when an officer gives a command we expect it to be followed. the way it looks right now, it was not followed. we also spoke to the -- it's true that a grand jury could be convened as part of the investigation into what happened. >> a tragic situation.
there was another situation very different. this taking place in new york. that is a lot of people upset there. we're talking about a shooting of a man, again, by a police officer. very different circumstances. what happened? >> police are calling this one a very unfortunate tragedy. they said this was all an accident. an accidental discharge, and the victim, 28-year-old akai girly, they say was a total innocent. it happened friday in what police are describing as a pitch black stairway in the housing projects in brooklyn. he was entering on the seventh floor. the officer was entering on the eighth floor. the officer's gun went off, shooting the boy in the chest. these people aren't the only ones that have questions about how this could have happened. the brooklyn district attorney, ken thompson, he said in a statement that the shooting was "deeply troubling and warrants an immediate, fair, and thorough
investigation." the officer, i should note, fred, was a rook where i. he was still on probationary status. less than 18 months on the job. he has been stripped of his badge and his gun for now. >> sarah gannon, thank you so much for that report. two tragic situations. very different shootings and circumstances. but could these incidents, both of them, have been prevented? for more on that i'm joined now by retired defect i steve rogers and here with me in atlanta defense attorney tanya miller. let's start with the cleveland shooting, and let's begin with you, steve. do you think this is just a tragic case he didn't fn that gun was real or fake. that 911 call kim in that there was a gun being pointed at feel.
the officer, he gave a lawful order, and very sadly and unfortunately, the 12-year-old did not obey the order, and the officer had to make a quick split second decision. it's usually the decision that's based on either see someone die or you do, or, unfortunately, you'll have to take the necessary action to prevent that from happening. >> does it also conger the idea or thoughts that you see it's a kid as you arrive on the scene. that perhaps there may have been some dialogue that takes place, or by virtue of you being the adult, you being the bigger person, maybe you could have tried to tackle the person. are any of those scenarios realistic in your view? >> keep in mind, fredericka, that most of the school shootings around this nation that kill many, many dozens of children, those crimes are perpetrated by kids. it's sad. it's unfortunate. 20, 80, or 12, you point a gun at somebody, that bullet is going to find a target and kill that person. >> so then, tanya, is that partly to blame here that we're
talking about a climate, you know be, of tragedies involving young people in recent years and so no longer is there that kind of presumed innocence when you talk about kids and so officers on the scene are going to treat them just like they would an adult who may appear to be a threat? >> maybe. i think whenever you're looking at an officer's use of excessive force or deadly force, you have to look at the reasonableness of his conduct, right? so, of course, what's going on around him, what he knew, what he understood, the circumstances of the case, those are all going to factor into whether or not the shooting is going to be deemed to be justified or not. i do think in this case there were at least some evidence that the officer had that the gun may have been a toy. we don't know exactly. we heard that the child was -- >> we know there's a dispatch that 911 call, but we don't know whether that was conveyed to the police officer that responded. that's, you know -- >> see, those are things that are going to have to be investigated and certainly we'll want to know that before we determine whether or not a charge is appropriate or whether the use of force was justifiable, but, again, i agree
with you, fred. i mean, we have a 12-year-old kid at a rec center. maybe he was at the time i think at least he was seated. if he was reaching for his waist band, were there things the officer could have done short of shooting him to try to gain control of that situation? those are questions that we have. we'll have to see what the investigation reveals. >> those questions will be asked and perhaps answered. tanya miller, steve rogers, appreciate you as well. thank you. now to ferguson, missouri, where residents are anxiously awaiting a grand jury's decision on the fatal police shooting of michael brown. law enforcement officials tell cnn the jury reconvenes tomorrow and protesters, they're already voicing their action newsing over the death of this unarmed black teen in anticipation of a decision. they're also demanding an indictment against darren wilson, the white police officer who killed brown.
>> sarah, many thought the grand jury might reach a decision by friday. that didn't happen. they'll reconvene tomorrow. what's the climate of things there where you are? >>. >> this town has been on pins and needles for many, many weeks, month, actually. and every time there is some new information that comes out from sources saying that the grand jury is meeting or it could happen soon, it certainly heightens tensions here or at least it heightens nervousness. we should point out the only people that know when the grand jury's decision is coming are the 12 people on that grand jury. in order for there to be an indictment, nine of the 12 have to vote yes. they are the only ones that can really tell us when exactly it's over, and they are supposed to keep quiet until the decision is made and then that information
will go to the prosecuting attorney's office. a lot of folks just waiting to hear, and there have been plenty of people who are preparing, businesses, some of them very close to the police department have boarded up. many of them, most of them, i should say, were the very early protests happening in august where they started. they have all boarded up with the exception of perhaps one business. then you just have regular folks around here just waiting and watching and wondering, and, of course, the police and the national guard are all at the ready at this point in time. the protesters themselves have said, look, we've been protesting for weeks now with no real issues, no violence, no one has been hurt. nobody has been, you know, breaking up different things. they have been peaceful, and they said we're going to try to continue that. whatever the decision is. freddy. >> thanks so much. in ferguson. we'll check back with you. we're also following another developing story. a suicide bomber has attacked a volleyball match in afghanistan.
at least 45 people have been killed. 60 others are wupded. payton wallace is live now from turkey, along the border there. nick, any idea of who carried out this attack? the group say strong part of the insurgency there. these sort of attacks on civilians aren't really their calling card. it's unclear who did it, but essential they targeted a provincial level, a high level volleyball match here. a lot of civilians in the crowd looking on where the bomb was detonated, and 100 lives affected. 45 dead. 60 injured too. people still really counting the toll here. it comes just after the white house made it clear they wanted to expand u.s. capabilities in the years ahead and just today the lower house of the afghan parliament ratified a key agreement called a bsa which allows u.s. forces to have a
sustained presence in the years ahead. remember, the previous president of afghanistan, hamid karzai, had made it so clear he didn't really want to see americans there in the future. the new president, quits a different term. >> thank you so much. appreciate that. coming up after being buried under seven feet of snow, buffalo is bracing for more bad weather. a look at the new threat from mother nature that could prove even more dangerous. noirchlgts new we're getting word the deadline for a nuclear deal may be delayed, but what does this mean for the united states? cnn's jim shoedo live from the top of vienna. >> a last minute flurry of diplomatic here in guinea. less than 24 hours to go before that dead looirn. i'll have more after this break. huh, fifteen minutes could save you fifteen percent or more on car insurance. everybody knows that. well, did you know words really can hurt you? what...?
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now a senior u.s. state department official tells us the deadline may be extended. iranian media report that because of the limited time it would be "impossible to find common ground. this while u.s. secretary of state john kerry says big gaps still remain in the negotiations that will likely shape the u.s. relationship with iran for years to come. our chief national security krbt jim shudo is in vienna. re sfwl a saya is in iran. an analyst and research associate at m. i.t.'s security studies program. good to see all of you. jim, let me begin where you. the u.s. had been reluctant to discuss extending the talks. what's changed?
>> they wanted to say we're still laser focused on getting an agreement. putting that out there lays the ground work for that happening. there's an expectation management preparers for whatever damage control is necessary at that point. just a few minutes ago a meeting between secretary of state john kerry and the russian foreign minister, there was a one-on-one between kerry and the key, of course, the iranian foreign minister. we know there's going to be a working dinner tonight among the western powers. they're still pushing. the question is what are they pushing for? are they pushing just for an extension, or are they pushing for something that's beyond an extension. moving the ball forward even if they don't, fred, reach a final agreement. >> was there err a feeling that the deadline would be met? >> i think a lot of people were
hopeful, especially the iranian population that are eager to reach an agreement. eager for the sanctions to be lifted. this is also a very politically savvy and aware population, and the position is that we'll believe it when we see it. as far as iran's position at this hour, according to state media, they don't really want an extension of these talks. one source saying that even if we extend these talks, it doesn't mean that we're going to reach an agreement. the statement could be gamesmanship. it could be posturing. we'll have to wait and see. certainly the clock is ticking. >> how do you -- jim walsh, how do you interpret this possible extension? is that a sign of hope, or is that a pessimistic piece of development?
>>. >> that means that the patient is in a coma, and you should go ahead and schedule the funeral down the line because what's going to happen is if they're not close, congress -- a new congress is going to come in and pass sanctions. then the iranian legislature is going to feel compelled to retaliate to tit for tat and back and forth we will go, and this will slip away. is there all talk of what happens if this doesn't work? >> there is, although at this point they don't want to talk about that. they clearly do want to get to
some sort of deal. i think jim walsh makes a good point there because there are two kinds of extension. one is that kicking the ball down the road. the other one is where you have made progress, but not enough progress to reach a final agreement. i'll tell you, i think that is really the best case scenario at this point because the idea of narrowing these gaps in the next 24 hours looks somewhat unlikely, but the measure of success will be can they push that ball forward? remember, tremendous political pressure both at home in the u.s. and also in iran for progress here, to have another extension of the status quo. difficult to sell at home for both sides. >> fantastic. perspectives from all around the world. jim in vienna. reza and jim walsh. thank you so much. appreciate that. all right. still ahead, first, big snow in buffalo. now the threated of dangerous flooding. we go live there next. [ children yelling ] [ telephone rings ] [ shirley ] edward jones. this is shirley speaking.
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if you want the individual attention and expertise your financial needs deserve, this is your time. this is your private bank. warmer weather should be welcome news for folks in buffalo. as the mercury rises, so does the risk of flooding as mountains of snow start melting. alexandra fields joins me from buffalo. how does it look out there?
kind of slushy. is it causing big problems yet? >> no, no big problems yet. they've cleared a lot of the streets, but there are still a lot of piles of snow that immediate to be removed. that is the focus right now. it's a job that a big team of people are doing. they're working together around the clock at an incident command center in buffalo. we talked about how they're handling this snow and the coming threat. >> this is an old facility, but as can you see, very functional. >> you are in here around the clock? >> 24-7. we have new york estate and office of emergency management here. we have fdny. we have national grid. we have utility services here. everybody is in a room. new york city is here. they're out in the field. mapping data and send it back here. they're showing us what streets are cleared. you know, what streets are impassable sfwloosh they're looking at the city like a grid. >> yesterday our mission was really just to check out bpw was doing on road clearing. >> had you your phone. >> pretty much just the phone. the camera also. when we open the application, it
pushes everything straight back to that map we have. >> look at the dots on the map mean? >> these dots were all areas that we collected. all the pictures with geotags. you can see where that picture was taken. she just climbed out. this was on the stevens bridge, which we were told is prone to ice dams in the spring sgroosh you are adding layers of data to this. >> you come back, and you sthee picture. what does this tell you? >> they made a pass down that street. looks like we can access this street if there's an issue on that street and so our response crews would know that in advance. >> this is a really significant part of the operation for you. >> on what the information they are giving us is literally saving lives. >> have you had a setup command of this scale here before? >> not on this scale. never on this scale. yeah. we have structural collapsing. we have a water rescue team here. the logistics are quite amazing. >> mayor of buffalo says so far they lifted up and carted away 80,000 tons of snow.
the goal right now along the picking up of the snow is really clearing the storm drains. that's a best chance for mitigating any risks of flooding as the temperature rises over the next day. fred. >> oh, my goodness. i know folks are bracing, and then hoping for the best. we're hoping for the best for the folks in buffalo too. alexandra, thanks so much. >> one of one of the most prestigious universities in the nation sppdz all fraternities after a stunning accusation of sexual assault. well, will other universities follow suit? it gets. wouldn't it be great if hiring plumbers, carpenters and even piano tuners were just as simple? thanks to angie's list, now it is. we've made hiring anyone from a handyman to a dog walker as simple as a few clicks. buy their services directly at angieslist.com no more calling around. no more hassles. start shopping from a list of top-rated providers today. angie's list is revolutionizing local service again. visit angieslist.com today.
>> here's a look at top stories making news right now. a 12-year-old boy carrying a fake gun was shot and killed by police in cleveland. police say officers were called to a recreation center because a person was waving around a fwun. investigators say police told the boy to put his hands up in the air, but he didn't, and police opened fire. investigators say the boy's
weapon turned out to be an air soft replica gun. in ferguson, missouri, an anxiety filled weekend as the community waits to hear whether a grand jury might indict darren wilson. the grand jury expected to reconvene tomorrow, monday. the white police officer shot and killed michael brown, an unarmed black teenager. law enforcement officials tell cnn the jury will indeed reconvene. people held protests throughout the weekend, and police say two out of state people who were blocking traffic were arrested for unlawful assembly. all fraternities and parties associated with them until january the 9. this comes after rolling stone making sfleen published an article last week about a student who said she was gang-raped at a frat party. now her story has brought a federal investigation of the prestigious school and is exposing an alleged cultural issue at college campuses around
the nation. here's swroe johns. >> it's a shocking allegation of rape at the university of virginia. there's a story about a first year student said to be considering suicide after she went to a party in 2012 at the phi kappa si fraternity. gran its leg, and that's when jackie knew she was going to be raped. she remembers every moment of the next three hours of agony during which she says seven men took turns raping her. ann where i forest is a friend of the accuser. >> she was just doing what a normal girl on a date would do, and then he led her upstairs, and where she was taken into a room and pretty much ambushed by these men. >> since the article, mother student has come forward. similar story. same fraternity. >> i had to walk on campus with
my rapists for the next two and a half years. >> and the issue is not just one fraternity house or even one school. >> i was told that university of virginia is actually quite typical. even though the things that i discovered at university of virginia are really horrifying, what i was told is that really what happens at uva is probably fairly normal at a college campus. >> according to rolling stone, the accuser did not report the incident at the time to police, but did speak to a university official. >> when she left the fraternity house that night and called some of her friends, they actually recommended that she not go to the police. >> at the university damage control is in hyper drive and police are investigating. the fraternity chapter is suspending all activities and said it will cooperate fully with the investigation. uva's president said in a statement that the report includes "many details that were not previously disclosed to university officials. the university takes seriously the issue of sexual misconduct.
we have recently adopted several new initiatives and policies aimed at fostering a culture of reporting and raising awareness. it's a national problem. 88 colleges and universities are under investigation for how they handle sex assault cases. a former dean at uva is now the national president of a group dedicated to ending sexual assault on campus. he says schools could be sanctioned. >> they could face a loss of federal funding which would decimate an entire institution. that has never been done, but there are fines that the office of civil rights can levy. >> important to say that in the case of uva, it was the university that called for authorities to get involved, including police and the virginia attorney general's office. >> uva said this "the wrongs
described in rolling stones is appalling and has all of us -- considering her statement, is this suspension which goes through what, thanksgiving and the winter breaks, they come back to school in january, is that enough? >> well, it's hard to say whether it's enough. i mean, suspending all of the fraternities pending an investigation, look, the bottom line is since title nine and the office of civil rights in the last ten years universities have been under a tremendous economic incentive to investigate these cases and many would argue -- many defense attorneys would argue -- to find guilty students or convict students because they use standards like a preponderance of evidence. students aren't given the same due process rights. to say that universities have not as a culture been investigating sexual assault cases is really not accurate because the last deckated alone has seen a tremendous rise, a
tremendous incentive for attorneys -- or for universities to investigate, prosecute, and some would argue find accused students guilty. look, when it comes to fraternities and sororities, many would say that their time may be at an end. they just are hotbeds of liability, and maybe too much going on with too little supervision. >> clou agree with that? the incentive just hasn't been there? in "the rolling stone" article it said uva suspended 183 people for honor code violations which would be tantamount to cheating on exams, but no student has ever been expelled for sexual assault or alleged sexual assault. >> you know, i'll tell you what surprises me about this. this talk of a rape culture existing in american universities and specifically in fraternities. even currently. bare in mind, for the last ten to 15 years, our societial attitudes about this sort of
thing have changed radically. if we were talking about the 1950s to 1960s, this wouldn't surprise me, but i'm frankly stunned. if these allegations are true, that seven men cool have raped a woman in a fraternity house and then her complaints ignored by the university, it's a shocking indictment if true, but i think we have to be careful here and remember what happened in the duke case which looked like a shocking indictment of duke and the lacrosse team, and that story kind of fell apart in the months to come. i would like to see what all of the details are here, and before, you know, we condemn everyone. nonetheless, if it's true, fredericka, it's stunning and shocking and you need major changes not only at virginia, but other places if this is what's going on. >> right. danny, of course, you know, a lot more evidence would have to be forward before anyone can make up their mind about it, but at least according to that article, if one student in that article said one of her alleged attackers actually told another attacker "we all had to do it,
so you do too, if that is true, it sounds like we really are talking about a cultural problem if not just on that campus, but then, you know, maybe on other campuses too potentially? >> well, what are we saying about a cultural problem? investigating and prosecuting sexual assault cases is doyle a college campus. it's difficult at work, in the home. it's difficult everywhere. the very nature of it is asking someone to come forward and speak about something incredibly uncomfortable and devastating. in many of these cases, citizens realize that by the time it gets to trial, if there's no forensics, if there's no rape kit, it will come down to a credibility determination and how well they perform on the witness stand. no matter whether you are at a university or out in anywhere else, the idea of doing that is terrifying to complainants. i don't know if there's any more of a culture at universities than there is anywhere else
since time for all of humanity. prosecuting these cases, investigating them has always been difficult. >> you know, the thing that occurs to me too is rape is such a serious crime, and we have this thing at universities where women are supposed to go and report it to the administration and then they handle it internally. you know, we don't do that in murder cases. you go to the police right away. big cities have special victims units. they have levels of sophistication in handling victims, and i'm just wondering if we're using a wrong mechanism to investigate these cases, and women are suffering as a result of it. >> all right. paul, danny, thanks to the both of you gentlemen. we'll leave it there. >> thank you. major obama fundraiser is facing sex abuse charges. why his lawyer says it's all the result of an extortion attack. that's next.
sxwlirchlgts the american lurchlged a foundation. it delegates to ten igs, community service, and his christian faith. the 42-year-old is now keener than ever to pass on that winning mindset that searched him so well as a player. >> my mentality was i've been given this talent. you know shlgs certainly i want to go out and make the very, very most of it. i want to become the best tennis player that i can be, but at the same time i had this platform. i had this platform to touch lives. hopefully inspire some kids. but if i have gone and spent my 16 plus years, you know, going out and trying to achieve my own things but never did anything for anybody, never, you know, took the time to spend to either sign an autograph or talk to a youngster or somehow encourage them, then really kind of what's it all for? you know, sometimes i think
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they just didn't think it could happen. they told the house they would take better care of her... always. announcer: protect what matters. get flood insurance. main president obama once called a great supporter and friend is facing sex abuse charges in oregon. democratic donor terry bean is charged with buzing a 15-year-old boy last year. here's cmn's aaron mcpike. >> terry breen bean has been a marriage fund rarz for president obama bundling a reported half million dollars for his 2012 re-election campaign. >> i want to thank somebody who put so much work into this event, taefr bean. give him a big round of applause. >> here's mr. obama praising bean at a 2009 event for the human rights campaign. the politically influential gay rights group he co-founded. >> to my great friend and
supporter terry bean, co-founder of hrc. also raused on the same charges, 25-year-old kyle lawson, identified in news reports as bean's former boyfriend. in statement bean's laur says "over the course of several months in 2013 and 2014 terry was the victim of an extortion renk led by several men known to law enforcement. this current arrest is due to the ongoing investigation of that case in which mr. bean has fully cooperated. no allegations against terry bean should be taken at face value. we look forward to the opportunity to clear his name. lawson's former attorney told the oregonian newspaper that lawson had stumbled upon a camera bean had used to secretly record sexual encounters with him and other men, took screen
shots, and hoped to secure money from bean in an exchange for their return. that led bean to allege extortion. >> aaron mcpike joining me from the white house. what more do we know about terry bean and what's next? >> well, fred, i have asked the white house if they have had a reaction to this situation. we have not heard anything back wret. we have, however, heard from the human rights campaign and a spokesman for that organization told us in a statement that terry bean has taken a voluntarily leave of absence until these issues are resolved, fred. >> all right. thanks so much. all right. he was one of the nation's most well known mayors in washington d.c. he was elected and re-elected to public office. many times marion barry was nicknamed mayor for life. well, last night barry passed away at a d.c. hospital. barry was a civil rights activist and served four terms as d.c.'s mayor. his fall from political grace came during that notorious drug bust in 1990.
later, he would return to d.c. politics as a city councilman. i spoke with mr. barry last july about his life swrurny depicted in his book "mayor for life." >> i have had a rich life. not just a 15 minute soundbyte, but when you say washington d.c., everybody knows me. in 1965 washington was a sleepy southern town. no high-rises, no anything. no new buildings except the fbi building. look at washington for you. i have worked hard for the people, and i'm beloved by the people. >> overnight barry died at a washington hospital just hours after being released from another hospital in the city. he was 78 years old. senator lindsey graham is furious about an intel report concluding there was no coverup in the wrafr math of the
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rod issue for critics of the obama administration. graham is one of those critics. well, this morning on cnn's "state of the union" chief political analyst gloria borger reminded graham of his past statements on the issue. >> when susan rice said i have no regrets, i gave the american people the best evidence available, that's a bald-faced lie. >> this report says no one lied, period that, they were receiving bad information, but no -- or -- >> that's a bunch of garbage. that's a complete bunch of garbage. who told susan rice -- >> why is the republican chairwoman of the house intelligence committee buying a bunch of garbage? >> good question. >> answer it. yeah. >> why -- that's -- yeah, i don't believe that the report is accurate given the role that mike morrell played in misleading the congress on two occasions. why didn't the report say that? here's my point. when susan rice was on television after the attack, she
said on three different occasions the consulate was strongly, substantially, and significantly secured. nothing could have been further from that -- from the truth, and there's nothing in the talking points about the level of security. she gave an impression to the american people that these folks were well taken care of when it was, in fact, a death trap. who told her to say that? ben rhodes came up with the talking points saying under no circumstance can we suggest this was anything other than a riot caused by a video, when there was no evidence of that. >> to your point about the death trap, senator, this report also says that there -- i'm quoting here -- that there was no evidence, that there was ae stand-down order or a denial of available support. do you still believe that there was? this report puts all the blame on the state department and ab
solves the defense community. when the committees looked at it, the department of defense was held blameless. at the end of the day everybody is pointing fingers to everybody else. heats why you need a joint select committee. thank gord for tre wr gowdy and elijah cummings. when the committee says there's no evidence of manipulating the american people, that is absolute garbage. >> graham also had a lot to say about this week's executive action on immigration from president obama. more on that next hour. often the packages are stolen right off the doorsteps. now, guess what. there's an app to stop those thefts. ♪
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>> some of these universities are starting to look like resorts with pricey amenities like spas, rock walls, and swimming pools, and they're passing along the bill to students. tuition expenses have risen more than 1,200% sense 1978, but blackburn college in illinois is keeping tuition costs low thanks to a little thrift. >> we're expanding $2.5 million renovation product. student work crews are paying for it. ♪ >> students for years have been literally laying the bricks. >> laying the bricks. ♪ >> do maintain organizational staffing structure, and that is done with the expectation that we do use students to supplement those labor needs. >> it's not just construction jobs. 90% of the student body works ten hours per week on campus. in everything from gardening to
security to administrative positions. in turn they get tuition credit. >> they say i don't want them to go to spend four years to learn. >> we do have that. we do have parents that question that piece of it, sf what we explain to them is that this is an enhancement. this is an enhancement to their overall portfolio that will make them more marketable upon graduation. >> can you grab me 431? >> sof wear john manages blackburn's motor vehicle fleet. >> they call your generation generation debt. does that worry you at all? >> by the decisions that i have made with school not really. i came for the work program because i felt with baseball and school and a job i wouldn't have time to get distracted by video games or going out to parties. i actually went to michigan state university. they had big pools, nice buildings, newer dorms, but it was kind of a distraction. i'm here for an education. >> all